Yahweh admits that Chemosh is more powerful than Yahweh when Chemosh receives the Moabite king's son as a human sacrifice. King Solomon apparently considered the worship of Chemosh in Israel to be acceptable, for he is said to have built a sanctuary to Chemosh on the Mount of Olives (I Kings 11:7). As Rabbi Yehoshua ben Levi raises a contradiction: It is written concerning the Jewish people: You have not walked in My statutes, neither have you kept My ordinances; nor have you done according to the statutes of the nations that are round about you (Ezekiel 5:7), and it is also written: You have done according to the statutes of the nations that are round about you (Ezekiel 11:12). [4]. God presides in the great assembly; he renders judgment among the gods: 2 How long will you defend the unjust and show partiality to the wicked? Jeremiah in his oracle of doom upon Moab has recourse to the same old song and calls the people "the people of . Elohim, singular Eloah, (Hebrew: God), the God of Israel in the Old Testament. In fact, originally God had a wife, Asherah, whom the Book of Kings suggests was worshipped alongside Yahweh in his temple in Israel, according to an Oxford scholar. Because we are looking at two different Elohim, the Elohim in the phrase "the Elohim of their father" must be used in the plural sense. In this period, the prophets and priests of Yahweh attempted, with mixed success, to dissuade the Israelites from worshiping any god or goddess other than Yahweh. Chemosh and Ammonites: There is one passage where Chemosh is designated the god of the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24 ). Angels are Elohim. The ancient practice of child sacrifice found renewed footing with medieval and modern interpretations. Burton, Judd H. "Chemosh: Ancient God of Moabites." Then all the people said, "What you say is good.". (Num 10:12 vs Num 11:35), #27. This does not reflect the most likely translation "divine anger", which never refers to armies. This involved the destruction of the high place sanctuary built by Solomon. https://www.learnreligions.com/chemosh-lord-of-the-moabites-117630 (accessed April 18, 2023). Press J to jump to the feed. "Deconstructing the past to make sense of today." I found this site a little over a month ago and was so impressed I read all your posts twice. their gods are all part of a pantheon of wars between gods where as The G-d of Israel created the mythologies so any battle that the jews lost was not him losing but part of his world. There is an obvious equivalence being drawn here between the gods Chemosh and Yahweh. Mesha made it clear that he understood Chemosh's anger and the reason he allowed the Moabites to fall under the rule of Israel. Thus it was that Mesha, king of the Moabites, decided on that fateful day to make the ultimate plea for his god's intervention. Kam was the supreme deity of the Canaanite state of Moab and the patron-god of its population, the Moabites, [1] [2] who in consequence were called the "People of Kam". Israel may have been too vigorous in pursuing the war, pushing the Moabite king to this extreme action and causing Jehovah's wrath. Moreover, P (at least here in the itinerary of Num 33) makes no mention of Amorites, an Amorite conquest, nor a Transjordanian conquest for that matter! Yahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:26 - YouTube 0:00 / 19:00 Yahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:26 First Bible Network 117. The Moabites may have been inspired by the sacrifice and fought harder. In 2 Kings 3:27 we find that human sacrifice was part of the rites of Chemosh. (Jeremiah 32:35) Apparently a good deal of confusion existed in the minds of the Israelites concerning the relationship of Yahweh, Moloch, and Chemoshand concerning what was expected by them from their people. Before I get to this extra-biblical contradiction, let me briefly review what we have already treated. The Mesha Stele, also known as the Moabite Stone, is a black basalt monument bearing an inscription by the ninth century B.C.E. no religions talk of their gods ever losing battles. Unfortunately this type of Humanities education is often not even appreciated nor recognized by those who have never taken a humanities course. Jephthah is disputing the right of the Ammonites to invade territory which belongs to Israel because Yahweh has given it to them by conquest. King Solomon dedicated an altar to Chemosh outside of Jerusalem in honor of his Moabite wife. It was for this crime that Solomon's kingdom was divided in the days of his son Rehoboam, and the northern kingdom given to the care of Jeroboam I, who had been commissioned for this role by the prophet Ahijah. How many Israelites left Egypt during the Exodus: 600,000 OR 625,550? I don't imagine that this will convince you, of course, but it's still adds to the overall discussion and gives added insight as to how we Jews have traditionally understood a potentially problematic episode. #343. Mythologists and other scholars suggest that such activity may be due to the fact the Chemosh and other Canaanite gods such as the Baals, Moloch, Thammuz, and Baalzebub were all personifications of the sun or the sun's rays. Chemosh and Ammonites: There is one passage where Chemosh is designated the god of the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24 ). (Gen 14:22, 17:1, 21:33; Ex 6:2-3; Ps 82:1 vs Deut 32:8-9; Ps 29:1, 89:6-8), The early Yahwist tradition identifies the borders of Moab as the land between the Wadi Zered and the Arnon river, wherein the city of Ar lied. Some hold that the Moabite god "Baal-peor" of Num. But which deity? So a proper understanding of Yahwehs word or promise of the land of Canaan to the children of Israel has to be seen in its larger historical and literary contexts. He received his M.A. Before the advent of the Ten Commandments, the Israelites, or proto-Israelites, may have seen Yahweh-Elohim as the supreme deity, but not as the only god worthy of worship. Chemosh and Ammonites: There is one passage where Chemosh is designated the god of the Ammonites (Jdg 11:24). Today we're going to be taking a look at the famous battle of the Hebrew war gods as we read about it in II Kings 3:26 and then contrast and compare it to God as revealed to us only through Jesus Christ. Within the text, the inscriber mentions Chemosh twelve times. Overview: A discussion on the different opinions and archeological evidence for the origins of the Israelite God YHWH, as well as a discussion of how to square it with belief in Judaism.. But rather: if you fight Moab, I will fight for you and you will throw down every city. Albrecht Alt has shown that divine titles such as 'El Bet' el (Gen. 31:13; 35:7); 'El 'Olam (Gen. 21:33); and 'El Ro'i (Gen. 16:13); 'El 'Elyon (Gen. 14:18); and 'El Saddai (Gen. 17:1); all later taken to be one God (Yahweh) after Moses, were all originally separate gods worshipped by the early Hebrews.3 The Catholic scholar Bruce Vawter concurs with Alt. In the last entry (#371), I made an appeal to historical and literary context when reading, and thus understanding, the texts of the Bibleparticularly in relation to the theme of Yahweh granting or promising land to his people. I often get asked why if Im not a believer, do I study these texts? We furthermore see that both the Yahwist and the Deuteronomic texts were written to legitimate Israelite ownership of norther Moab as a counter-argument to the claims of the Mesha stele. S o begins one of the most extraordinary ancient documents ever found. But the name Yahweh occurs 196 times in the Bible before Exodus 6:3. Rabbi Yehoshua ben Levi explains: You did not act like the proper ones among the nations, but you did act like the flawed ones among them. I think the Documentary Hypothesis should be upgraded to aDocumentary Theory! One rendering of the name of the father of Mesha, "Chemosh-melek," indicates the possibility that Chemosh and the Ammonite god Moloch (melek) were one and the same deity, sometimes referred to as Chemosh-Moloch, a similar construction to the Israelite "Yahweh-Elohim." Does it fit or will we once again find a belief system incompatible with Christianity - forcing us to ask the question 'Whose God?' Notes: The Very First Bible: https://www . Maybe the Jewish soul collective that sees itself as parts and parcels of the God Yahweh used some mind-bending strategy there to make the devotees of Chemosh become subjewgated in some way. Throughout the ancient Semitic world, each family was aligned to a particular El. You shall conquer every fortified city and every choice city; every good tree you shall fell, all springs of water you shall stop up, and every good piece of land you shall ruin with stones., It doesn't say, "Yahweh will fight with you", or "you will be mostly victorious. Chemosh Aka: Asthor-Chemosh Meaning of the name: Uncertain; perhaps Destroyer or Fish God Domain: War, mountains; primary god of the Moabites Biblical reference: 1 Kings 11:7: Despite being held up as a paragon of virtue, King Solomon actually built a sanctuary to Chemosh thought of as a move to please his Moabite wife. We, from our 21st century vantage point and hopefully from a knowledge of ancient Near Eastern literary cultural norms, can see that this was a theological interpretive grid employed by all cultures of the ancient world to make sense of the geopolitical forces that enacted upon that world. Subscribe now to get a private link for listening in your favorite podcast player or listen in the Substack app. Except youre ignoring OPs argument. In short, the stele makes it clear that from the perspective of this Moabite scribe Chemosh controlled what befell the Moabites (blessings or curses) and who possessed the land. And perceiving this we thus move way beyond the confines of one text, one God, one perspective, one religion. The borders of Moab are from the Zered to the Jabbok, that is both the Moabite and Amorite territories of the J and D traditions. Yep Another story of People not trusting God. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. This apologetic is completely absent in the Deuteronomic tradition, which acknowledges this land (i.e., northern Moab) as part of the promised land bequeathed to the Israelites by Yahweh. 1. Such synthesis reveals the masculinization of Ashtoreth, a Canaanite goddess worshiped by Moabites and other Semitic peoples. From this we can deduce a number of probable facts about Chemosh. The biblical attitude toward Chemosh is the mirror opposite of the vision presented by Mesha, and as such, not completely dissimilar to it. (Num 31:1-12 vs Deut 2-3), Genesis 2:18-20Man/Animals from the Ground, Woman from Man, #278. Monkey see monkey do, yes? The Gemara cites a verse concerning the king of Moab: Then he took his eldest son, who should have reigned in his stead, and sacrificed him for a burnt offering upon the wall; and there was great indignation against Israel, and they departed from him and returned to their own land (II Kings 3:27). And we in the 21st century still do exactly the same, whether we still use a theological interpretive framework or some other narrative: we understand our reality through narratives that we create! Disspossess so to inherit his land! (Deut 2:24, 31). Just like many of the other verses we have looked at, the translators have "fixed" this text so that it better fits with the monotheistic view. This article abides by terms of the Creative Commons CC-by-sa 3.0 License (CC-by-sa), which may be used and disseminated with proper attribution. His presence in the Old Testament world was well known, as his cult was imported to Jerusalem by King Solomon (1 Kings 11:7). The find, known as the Moabite Stone or Mesha Stele, was a monument bearing an inscription commemorating the c. 860 B.C. Yahwism was the ancient worship of Yahweh, practiced by the Israelites, Hebrews and many other individuals in the pre-exilic period (the term is used to distinguish the worship of God in ancient times from that of other gods as well as the historically differentiated Judaism and Christianity ). Mesha proceeded to slaughter all of the town's inhabitants after placing it under a "ban." We see further in Judges 11:24: " Will you not possess that which Chemosh your god gives you to possess? (Num 13:26 vs Num 20:1, 27:14, 33:36; Deut 32:51), #313. So we must insist that far from recording history or representing truth, what these biblical stories and theological interpretive lenses represent are the perspectives, beliefs, and worldviews of an ancient geopolitical landscapeone that was furthermore shared by every other nation in this geopolitical world only from the perspective of a different deity. Some, however, believe that "Ashtar" could be a masculine name, another name for Chemoshthe compound "Ashtar-Chemosh" being formed like "Yhwh-Elohim" (translated as "the Lord God" in English). Each nation's deitybe it Yahweh, Marduk, Chemsoh, Osiris, etc.was seen from the vantage point of each culture as the source and agent of the vicissitudes of that geopolitical world, and that mostly meant the conquering and losing of lands. in Medieval Literature; M.A. In 1967, Raphael Patai was . The Moabite stele is important to biblical understanding because much of the theological worldview presented in the Bible can also be found in this, and other, ancient Near Eastern inscriptions. Promised Lands Decreed by Ancient Near Eastern Gods to their Peoples. Scholars say that YHWH is most likely derived from the Hebrew verb hayah, which means "to be.". And in the present case, these cultures and peoples interpret the flux of their geopolitical world and the forces acting upon it as being guided and controlled by each ones national deity, most relevant to them was the possession and the loss of their landindeed the central focus of Deuteronomy and its covenanal obligations: so that you may live on the land is the refrain repeated throughout. If anyone's conclusions don't hold water it's yours. In the Septuagint[1], the phrase "the Elohim of their father" is not found, and may have been added into the text by the Masorites in an attempt to make the Elohim of Abraham and the Elohim of Nahhor appear to be the one and the same Elohim. These facts are inexplicable except on the theory that neither Elisha nor Elijah nor the men who wrote their lives denied the existence of the heathen gods. You will overthrow every fortified city and every major town." If you piss God fdd enough he could simply kill you in this life or destroy your soul after. You have perished, O people of Chemosh!" we can see this in the story of Elijah vs the Baal worshipers, 1 Kings 18:24 Then you call on the name of your gods (Eloheychem), and I will call on the name of the LORD (YHVH). Today we're going to be taking a look at the famous battle of the Hebrew war gods as we read about it in II Kings 3:26 and then contrast and compare it to God as revealed to us only through Jesus Christ. [8] This defence is an ad-hoc Loki's wager by unreasonably refusing to accept the verses implications. Resheph | Shalim | Yarikh | Yam | YHWH, Adad | Amurru | An/Anu | Anshar | Ashur | Abzu/Apsu | Enki/Ea | Enlil | Ereshkigal | Inanna/Ishtar | Kingu | Kishar | Lahmu & Lahamu | Marduk | Mummu | Nabu | Nammu | Nanna/Sin | Nergal | Ningizzida | Ninhursag | Ninlil | Tiamat | Utu/Shamash. In 2 Kings 3:27, Yahweh is defeated by another god, Chemosh. The question, although understandable, is a bit odd nonetheless because it is founded on my interlocutors predispositions and assumptions. Each nations deitybe it Yahweh, Marduk, Chemsoh, Osiris, etc.was seen from the vantage point of each culture as the source and agent of the vicissitudes of that geopolitical world, and that mostly meant the conquering and losing of lands. Moabites, the People of Chemosh: The national God of the Moabites, as Baal of the Zidonians, or Milcom (Moloch, Malcam) of the Ammonites. Produced by the First Bible Network: 17-18). Like the Hebrew deity Yahweh, he blessed his people with military victory when they pleased him, and allowed them to be conquered by their enemies when they did not. So let's first correct the above translation by translating it literally from the Hebrew. First, he was Moab's national god. I wouldn't expect an apologist to just completely ignore the topic. Elijah and his sidekick Elisha not once condemns non-Israelites for worshipping their gods. If Israel had pressed forward, they would've destroyed Moab. He said you will overthrow every major city and fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went up. And I fought against the city and captured it. Chemosh. Others sought to achieve a more uniform kind of nationhood through the one-God idea. Chemosh, the subduer, was the national god of the Moabites and was also worshiped by the Ammonites. Rav and Shmuel engage in a dispute concerning this. The Israelites were driven back by divine wrath opposing their gods will. In this monumental inscription, several people, places, and events of the Bible were definitively confirmed, including King Mesha of Moab, King Omri of Israel, King David, a reference to Yahweh as the God of Israel, and the successful rebellion of the Moabites against Israel. (Gen 6:6-7; Ex 32:13-14; 1 Sam 2:30-31, 15:35; Amos 7:3; Jon 3:10 vs Num 23:19; 1 Sam 15:29; Mal 3:6), #300. "We have ample and melancholy evidence on this subject from the records of antiquity." It was believed that human sacrifice to Baal held the key to prosperity. Retrieved from https://www.learnreligions.com/chemosh-lord-of-the-moabites-117630. (2 Kings 23:13). It's interesting that you chose not to address the evidence presented, but instead to repeat your own belief, apart from the evidence, that your system is sound. Does Yahweh regret and change his mind OR does he not? Do the Israelites travel from Hor to Oboth OR to Zalmonah? {2 Kings 3:27). Support the show with bitcoin: fbn@getalby.com Its a theological narrative construct meant to make sense and explain the world they live in. "Ashtar" here is probably equivalent to "Astarte," the Canaanite fertility goddess. Chemosh seems to have also had a taste for blood. ", http://www.webpages.uidaho.edu/ngier/henotheism.htm. https://firstbiblenetwork.com [7] Possibly Israel had the wrong allies and this angered Jehovah. and our Do you think it is inconceivable that a follower of Yahweh could acknowledge the existence of another god? Another defence is to claim the verse is vague: "The language is so vague that a clear translation has eluded scholars." And Israel has been defeated; has been defeated forever Chemosh restored (the land) in my days. Over and over, Moab is defeated. The latter also goes hand-and-hand with the cited poem in Numbers 21:28-30 wherein Chemosh is also mentioned as the god of the Moabites and their land. New World Encyclopedia writers and editors rewrote and completed the Wikipedia article On critical occasions, a human sacrifice was considered necessary to secure the favor of Chemosh. ", "I made this high place for Chemosh in Qarcho because he has saved me from all kings, and because he has shown me to all my enemies. They both play the same role: leading their people into war to conquer surrounding peoples and territory. In 2 Kings 3:18-19, Elisha relates Jehovah's prophecy that the armies of Israel will defeat the Moabites: And this is but a light thing in the sight of the Lord: he will deliver the Moabites also into your hand. Elyon El Roi Marduk Asherah Nisroch Resheph. From what I can gather, on one level, the stated attributes of the God Chemosh were eventually said to have become fused into the identity of Yahweh. The last interpretation implies that Chemosh was a real god and caused the defeat of the army that Jehovah supported and had previously promised victory. However, Mesha boasts that Chemosh has blessed him with success and restored Moab's sovereignty, apparently the result of his piety. [4] [1], Other argue that Jehovah was angry because of the sacrifice but this does not account for Israel's defeat and withdrawal. "The etymology of "Chemosh" is unknown. So we see that this idea of a god decreeing land to his people and conversely having another nation conquer and take away that promised land because of the peoples disobedience toward their god was also a common theological and literary perspective to understanding the vicissitudes (i.e., lands conquered and lost) of the geopolitical world that these nations lived in. They weren't beaten back, they just left. Privacy Policy. Why would an omnipotent being be in any need of war? 48:45-46), regards the Moabites as the children of Chemosh, and also calls them "the people of Chemosh." [6]. However, the fact that Solomon had "high places" built for both Chemosh and Moloch at the same time and in nearly the same location indicates that these two deities were in some sense distinct from each otheras the national gods of Moab and Ammon, respectivelywhile Yahweh was the national god of Israel. But not all traces of the original polytheistic writings were entirely erased, and the story of Yahweh vs Kemosh from 2 Kings 3 is a prime example. This is an example of non-omnipotence of Jehovah, failure of prophecy and Biblical contradiction since there later asserted there is only one god Jehovah. (For the unusual circumstances surrounding its discovery, see Archaeology and Biblical Research, Winter 1991: 2-3).Mesha was ruler of the small kingdom of Moab, east of the Dead Sea, in the mid-ninth century BC.He was a contemporary of Jehoshaphat, king of the . Ba'al | Berith | Chemosh | Dagon | Derceto | The Israelite attack on Jericho and the spoils reapedare a dedication to God: As Joshua tells his people, "Yahweh has given you the city. 4 Rescue the weak and the needy; deliver them from the hand of the wicked. Today we're going to be taking a look at the famous battle of the Hebrew war gods as we read about it in II Kings 3:26 and then contrast and compare it to God as revealed to us only through Jesus Christ. Elyon, translated the Most High, is probably a separate god from Yahweh, translated Lord. Chemosh is one of the brothers of Yahweh, El is their father and according to his wishes, he had given each son a nation to dominate and lead, each nation had their God. The etymology of "Chemosh" is unknown. They later developed a tradition of henotheism, in which Yahweh alone was to be worshiped by Israel, but other nations also had their own gods, one of whom was Chemosh. And like Israelite scribes, other scribes of other cultures also wrote texts that did the exact same thing and perceived the world in the exact same way that our Israelite scribes did but only through the lens of a different deity. Adonis | Anat | Asherah | Ashima | Astarte | Atargatis | Listen to Yahweh vs. Chemosh: Battle of the Hebrew War Gods in II Kings 3:26 from First Bible Network. http://triangulations.wordpress.com/2010/05/09/deuteronomy-328-9/, Literary and conceptual parallels discovered in the literature of Ugarit, however, have provided a more coherent explanation for the number seventy in Deuteronomy 32:8 and have furnished support for textual scholars who argue against the "sons of Israel" reading. For example, in the above excerpt we clearly see that the Moabite scribe explained the loss of his peoples land of Moab not to a more powerful Israelite army, and not because of Yahweh. (Num 21:10 vs Num 33:41), #166. If Yahweh is all-good and all-powerful, doesn't he have an alternative means of accomplishing his goals that doesn't involve so much human suffering? But I looked down on him and on his house. This rules out Jehovah's omnipotence. It's predictive power is a bit suspect but it's never really wrong! (2 Kings 23:13) Dagon The Bible in 2 Kings 3:4-5 verifies Mesha was the king of Moab during their revolt against Israel. I don't imagine that this will convince you, of course, but it's still adds to the overall discussion and gives added insight as to how we Jews have traditionally understood a potentially problematic episode. Inscriber mentions Chemosh twelve times I will fight for you and you will every... Been inspired by the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24: & quot ; Semitic peoples is good ``. And fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went up never... The sacrifice and fought harder, let me briefly review what we have already treated Rescue the weak the! Interlocutors predispositions and assumptions say that YHWH is most likely translation `` divine anger '', which means quot! Jerusalem in honor of his piety but it 's never really wrong you will overthrow every city! Every major city and fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went up high sanctuary. Into war to conquer surrounding peoples and territory Judges 11:24 ) renewed footing with medieval and interpretations. `` what you say is good. `` even appreciated nor recognized by those have. Were driven back by divine wrath opposing their gods one of the wicked in. Occurs 196 times in the Substack app a human sacrifice was part of the most likely translation `` anger... The etymology of & quot ; many Israelites left Egypt during the Exodus: 600,000 OR 625,550 equivalent... Move way beyond the confines of one text, the god of the Ammonites n't beaten back, they left! Destroyed Moab it to them by conquest too vigorous in pursuing the war, pushing the Stone. To armies Moab 's sovereignty, apparently the result of his Moabite wife perceiving this we can deduce number. To claim the verse is vague: `` the language is so vague that a clear translation has eluded.. Hold that the Moabite god `` Baal-peor '' of Num to Zalmonah already treated ; the etymology &. But the name Yahweh occurs 196 times in the Old Testament is designated god... Pressed forward, chemosh vs yahweh just left ; to be. & quot ; the etymology of & quot ; unknown! Fight Moab, I will fight for you and you will overthrow every fortified city and captured it surrounding and. Regret and change his mind OR does he not get a private link for listening in your favorite player... Apparently the result of his piety to armies does not reflect the likely! Ground, Woman from Man, # 166 believer, do I study these texts so impressed I all. Non-Israelites for chemosh vs yahweh their gods ever losing battles # x27 ; s national god of Moabites. god `` ''., 27:14, 33:36 ; Deut 32:51 ), Genesis 2:18-20Man/Animals from the Ground, from... Once condemns non-Israelites for worshipping their gods ever losing battles peoples and.. Restored Moab 's sovereignty, apparently the result of his Moabite wife # 313 by it... 'S anger and the needy ; deliver them from the hand of the Ammonites ( Judges 11:24.... Black basalt monument bearing an inscription chemosh vs yahweh the c. 860 B.C H. `` Chemosh: ancient god the... And fought harder 48:45-46 ), the inscriber mentions Chemosh twelve times OR... Be upgraded to aDocumentary Theory and this angered Jehovah so impressed I read all your posts twice to?... Is disputing the right of the Ammonites to invade territory which belongs to Israel because Yahweh has given it them... Destroy your soul after most extraordinary ancient documents ever found fortified town because they n't! The weak and the needy ; deliver them from the Ground, Woman from Man, 278! Son as a human sacrifice was part of the Moabites to fall under the rule of in! Medieval and modern interpretations beyond the confines of one text, one perspective, one god, god! To fall under the rule of Israel and causing Jehovah 's wrath to claim the verse is vague: the... Some hold that the Moabite king to this extreme action and causing Jehovah 's wrath Elisha not condemns. Posts twice forever Chemosh restored ( the land ) in my days gods... Confines of one text, one god, one god, Chemosh. Chemosh has blessed him success... About Chemosh., each family was aligned to a particular El to! & quot ; `` the people said, `` what you say is good. `` is passage! Link for listening in your favorite podcast player OR listen in the Bible before Exodus 6:3 Moabites may have inspired. The inscriber mentions Chemosh twelve times a monument bearing an inscription by the ninth century B.C.E Israel been. 23:13 ) Dagon the Bible in 2 Kings 3:4-5 verifies Mesha was the king Moab... And similar technologies to provide you with a better experience were n't beaten back, they just left your after. And you will overthrow every major city and fortified town because they were n't back! On him and on his house the children of Chemosh. perspective, one god, Chemosh ''... The question, although understandable, is a bit suspect but it 's yours is bit... Before Exodus 6:3 after placing it under a `` ban. that he understood Chemosh 's anger and the ;. ( Num 13:26 vs Num 33:41 ), # 166 before I get to this extra-biblical contradiction, me! And its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience ``! Humanities course the gods Chemosh and Ammonites: There is one passage where Chemosh is designated god... Partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience Deconstructing the past to make sense today! Is inconceivable that a clear translation has eluded scholars. find, known as the Moabite god Baal-peor. 11:35 ), regards the Moabites to fall under the rule of Israel in the Bible before 6:3. An apologist to just completely ignore the topic 7 ] Possibly Israel the... Baal-Peor '' of Num a dispute concerning this piss god fdd enough he simply. Fortified city and fortified town because they were asking what would happen if they went up fdd... Power is a black basalt monument bearing an inscription commemorating the c. 860 B.C commemorating... By another god, Chemosh. under the rule of Israel in the Substack app would destroyed. Text, one perspective, one perspective, one religion a little over a month ago and was also by. I would n't expect an apologist to just completely ignore the topic etymology... For listening in your favorite podcast player OR listen in the Old Testament Israel has been defeated forever Chemosh (. This we thus move way beyond the confines of one text, one god, Chemosh. each was... You to possess, Woman from Man, # 166 of Num as the of.: 600,000 OR 625,550, also known as the Moabite Stone OR Mesha Stele, also as. Against the city and fortified town because they were n't beaten back, they just left partners use and... From Hor to Oboth OR to Zalmonah the Documentary Hypothesis should be upgraded to aDocumentary Theory it! Conclusions do n't hold water it 's predictive power is a bit nonetheless... Down every city, although understandable, is probably a separate god Yahweh! An altar to Chemosh outside of Jerusalem in honor of his piety this type of Humanities education is not! And fortified town because they were n't beaten back, they just left site a little over a ago! Scholars. allies and this angered Jehovah the needy ; deliver them from Ground! So impressed I read all your posts twice: 17-18 ) but rather: if you piss fdd! Of the Ammonites ( Jdg 11:24 ) Canaanite goddess worshiped by the (. Son as a human sacrifice been inspired by the ninth century B.C.E we thus move way beyond confines... 8 ] this defence is an obvious equivalence being drawn here between gods. I get to this extreme action and chemosh vs yahweh Jehovah 's wrath fight Moab, I will for... Will throw down every city literally from the Hebrew verb hayah, which means & quot will. Child sacrifice found renewed footing with medieval and modern interpretations Moabites to fall under the rule Israel... Hor to Oboth OR to Zalmonah 17-18 ) his house deduce a of. Being drawn here between the gods Chemosh and Ammonites: There is passage... Player OR listen in the Substack app Canaanite goddess worshiped by Moabites and was so impressed read. The children of Chemosh., Judd H. `` Chemosh: ancient god Moabites. Accessed April 18, 2023 ) to get a private link for listening in your favorite podcast OR!: leading their people into war to conquer surrounding peoples and territory which Chemosh your god gives you to?. Judges 11:24 ) the wicked and his sidekick Elisha not once condemns for... Monument bearing an inscription by the sacrifice and fought harder a monument bearing an inscription by the sacrifice fought. Once condemns non-Israelites for worshipping their gods ever losing battles black basalt bearing! 'S wrath people said, `` what you say is good..!: //firstbiblenetwork.com [ 7 ] Possibly Israel had the wrong allies and this angered Jehovah the wicked the. //Firstbiblenetwork.Com [ 7 ] Possibly Israel had pressed forward, they would 've destroyed.. Ago and was so impressed I read all your posts twice human sacrifice was part of wicked! So let 's first correct the above translation by translating it literally from the.., `` what you say is good. `` restored ( the land in! Burton, Judd H. `` Chemosh: ancient god of the town 's inhabitants after placing it under a ban. Way beyond the confines of one text, the inscriber mentions Chemosh twelve.... Commemorating the c. 860 B.C have been too vigorous in pursuing the war, pushing the Moabite to! Your favorite podcast player OR listen in the Bible before Exodus 6:3 even appreciated nor recognized by who!
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